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Author Topic: Spirituality and it's uses.  (Read 3055 times)
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Srusti.M
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« on: July 30, 2008, 04:05:27 PM »

Dear Uncles,

I learned a lot of things through this Forum. Before school starts Amma told me to check the points that I learnt through this Forums, actully I'm in that process of writing down. In that process I got a question : how will spirituality help me ?? Amma answered my question by saying that it makes life easier. For E.X. in my school if anybody says something that hurts me I get sad about it. At that time I will utilize Baba's words.

Quote
If anyone says anything don't argue with them, don't develop hatred, I'm in all.Just walk away



That would save a lot of time or else I would come home sad and want to get them back for what they said by hurting me.

Then I remembered Baba does things for our good. It reminded me of an Akbar and Birbal Story.


Once upon a time,

Birbal (intelligent and witty minister and Birbal's real name is Mahesh Das, I don't know why they changed his name Huh) had a habit of saying all that happens, happens for the best. One day Akbar (King) accidently cut his finger with his knife while cutting an apple.All the ministers were showing sympathy to the king but Birbal said all that happens, happens for the best , Akbar got very angry and said "how can cuttng my finger be good"?? Birbal said cooly, "It is your Highness you will realise later" Akbar lost his temper and said " guards put Birbal in prison"! So Birbal was put into prison without doing any crime.

The next day Akbar goes hunting he rode very fast to catch a deer and parted from his hunting group. Unfortunately a tribe of savages found Akbar.They caught the king and tied him to a tree. Soon, they decided to sacrifice him to their Rain God.This would ensure a good rainfall that year they thought.They bathed Akbar's body while doing so,they noticed his injured finger.They immediately began whispering amongst themselves. The plan for the sacrifice was dropped. If an injured man was sacrifice,their Rain God would get angry.So they were forced to release Akbar. The Emperor quickly returned to the city. Akbar thanked God for injuring his finger. This has saved him. Then he remembered Birbal's words all that happens, happens for the bestHe released his minister. " My friend, please accept my sincere apologies " and told his story. Birbal simply smiled and bowed before akbar. Akbar was puzzled. Birbal said "If you have't thrown me in prison I'd have accompanied you on the hunt and the savages would have killed me, since i was't injured.



Uncles, do you want to say something?
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Dwarakanath
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« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2008, 10:59:15 AM »

Jai Sai Master!

Good point and a good story Srusti.

A simple way of saying an answer to the question "How will spirituality help me?" is to say "Spirituality is the only way to happiness. Do I want happiness? If so, I need spirituality. Simple."

As Master says, since everyone wants happiness, any one who knows what spirituality is, cannot deny it nor stop himself from following it. Not just for saving time. Not just for FACING life, but to win.

Spirituality (Adhyatmikata in Telugu, more apt than the english word), is a way of life where love and righteousness, intelligence and correctness, peace and bliss are the hall marks. Its a way to live life the way it is meant to.

Ask your mother to read you Matam Enduku book, chapters 3 and 4. It should clear up a lot of things for you.

Jai Sai Master!!
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Srusti.M
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« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2008, 01:42:43 PM »

Dear Dwaraka Uncle,


Quote
As Master says, since everyone wants happiness, any one who knows what spirituality is, cannot deny it nor stop himself from following it. Not just for saving time. Not just for FACING life, but to win.


"Live to play, play to win"  I saw this quote on my Racket.

Uncle Master said that anyone who knows what spirituality is can't deny it or can't stop themself from following it. But there are some people that know spirituality keep forgetting Master's and Baba's words. For E.X. pretend I know spirituality but somene says something unnecessarily, it hurts me. I know that Baba said, If anyone says anything don't argue with them, don't develop hatred, I'm in all. Just walk away.
But because of my anger I don't want to follow that or I forget it. I will think, why can't I hurt them?? Just because they have Baba in them?? I  have Baba in me too. If they hurt the Baba inside me why can't I hurt the Baba inside them?? 

That is what some people think they know spirituality but don't follow it.What is the reason??


Quote
"Spirituality is the only way to happiness. Do I want happiness? If so, I need spirituality. Simple."


So Uncle are you saying that anybody that doesn't know Spirituality isn't happy??

What is the difference between Happiness and Bliss??

Ok Uncle I'll ask Amma to read Matam Enduku? 



 
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« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2008, 09:24:23 PM »

Jai Sai Master!

Quote
That is what some people think they know spirituality but don't follow it.What is the reason??

It means that they dont understand it. If at all they understand it, they cant stay away atleast from trying. But most people keep failing even if they want to. Thats because of weaknesses and lack of discipline. That is why, sincerity, discipline and persistence are great requisites for spiritual practice.

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So Uncle are you saying that anybody that doesn't know Spirituality isn't happy??

Yes. One who doesnt know spirituality cant be happy. But, 'spirituality' again, is just a name. One has to have that practice to be happy, whether one knows its name or not.

Its like healthy living. Say, i eat correctly, excersize, work correctly, play correctly and sleep correctly. That means I am living a healthy life. If I do it but dont know that its called 'healthy living', even then i will be healthy because I am doing it. Similarly, spirituality.

For example, there are people (Kalahari bushmen, for eg.) who are spiritual by culture and practice, but dont know that they are living spiritually. They just do it!! They are happy. So, one has to live spirituality to be happy, whether one knowingly does that or not.

Jai Sai Master!!
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Srusti.M
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« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2008, 04:18:36 PM »

Dwaraka Uncle,

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What is the difference between Happiness and Bliss??

I asked this question once. And I found out the answer today in Matam Enduku? Chapter 4 Anandam. It said that Happiness was temporary and that Bliss is ever-lasting happiness, which is continues. We experience Happiness everyday but gevan muktudu(those who get detached from sadness(ignorance) which causes unsatisfaction) have permanent Happiness which is Bliss. Happiness comes from money, fame, and power but Bliss comes from within you.


Quote
For example, there are people (Kalahari bushmen, for eg.) who are spiritual by culture and practice, but dont know that they are living spiritually. They just do it!! They are happy. So, one has to live spirituality to be happy, whether one knowingly does that or not.


Uncle tell me some more about Kalahari bushmen. Where do they live, are they some kind of tribe ?? 

I have one question, Why does everybody (on this forums) say Om Sai Ram/Jai Sai Master at the beginning/ending of every message ?? If I know the reason I would like to start doing it too.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2008, 07:39:32 PM by Srusti.M » Logged

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veda
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« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2009, 03:46:57 AM »

Jai Sai Master.

Dear Srusti,

1)Bushmen are a primitive Afrian tribe who live in Kalahari desert.They are very pure by culture...they dont have any exposure to outside world...they don't have the concept of owning something...which is the characteristic feature of spiritual way of living. if u watch the film 'Gods must be crazy', u can have a feel of their way of life. You can also surf the net for more information.

2)Baba and Mastergaru, though they took birth in two different physical bodies, have proved that they are one and same to many devotees, past and present. They are present everywhere and in every body. Their whole teachings concentrate on seeing baba/ Mastergaru in all.

When we say Jai Sai Master before we talk to anybody, we are reminding ourselves that there is baba in that person(s) and respect him accordingly.We can extend this thought process by also remembering that He is there in us, in him and in each aspect of our surroundings. He is there in the situation...watching our thoughts and actions all the time!!!

Saying Jai Sai Master is to understand that Baba and Master are one and same and He is there in all!!!!

Jai Sai Master.



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swayam
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« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2009, 04:35:53 AM »

Jai Sai Master!
As Master says, since everyone wants happiness, any one who knows what spirituality is, cannot deny it nor stop himself from following it. Not just for saving time. Not just for FACING life, but to win.
Jai Sai Master!!

Jai Sai Master!

Babu Garu,

In what way I should interpret a win here.Is this acheiving a personal goal or
is it acheiving ultimate goal of self-realization.
Also if it is a personal goal like getting good job etc, is it proper to use spirituality there in
acheiving a selfish goal.Iam just doing loud thinking.
I think using spirituality in acheving a selfish goal is acheving it in a rightful way, correct ?

Jai Sai Master!
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Srusti.M
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« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2009, 10:57:03 AM »

Veda Auntie, (As a child I don't know how to call everyone older than me than Uncle or Auntie, Please don't mind for addressing  like this.)

Quote
1)Bushmen are a primitive Afrian tribe who live in Kalahari desert.They are very pure by culture...they dont have any exposure to outside world...they don't have the concept of owning something...which is the characteristic feature of spiritual way of living. if u watch the film 'Gods must be crazy', u can have a feel of their way of life. You can also surf the net for more information.

How do the Kalahari Bushmen live without owning anything?? I can't imagine not having own clothes,house,parents,food,etc. How do they not own anything??  You mean to say as a spiritual person you are not supposed to own anything?? If they do own anything are they really not spiritual?? Since you said owning nothing is the characteristic feature of spiritual way of living.

I will try to get ahold of the movie "Gods Must Be Crazy".

Quote
2)Baba and Mastergaru, though they took birth in two different physical bodies, have proved that they are one and same to many devotees, past and present. They are present everywhere and in every body. Their whole teachings concentrate on seeing baba/ Mastergaru in all.

When we say Jai Sai Master before we talk to anybody, we are reminding ourselves that there is baba in that person(s) and respect him accordingly.We can extend this thought process by also remembering that He is there in us, in him and in each aspect of our surroundings. He is there in the situation...watching our thoughts and actions all the time!!!

When you said Baba is there in the situation watching our thoughts and actions, why did Baba create some situations like the bomb blasts in Mumbai, or the tsunami in Burma that killed innocent people?? For E.X. a patient who has a serious problem is admitted in a hospital. Baba created that situation because the patient got what was nessacery. As a doctor his duty is to rescue that patient, in this situation is the doctor going against Baba's will?? If Baba is in this situation why does the patient's family pray to Baba that he gets better?? Not just them, why do we pray even though Baba is in that situation too?? (I came to the same question why should we pray for better things?)

Quote
Saying Jai Sai Master is to understand that Baba and Master are one and same and He is there in all!!!!
 

But sometimes we forget that Baba is in everybody. How do we always remember?? In that case do we have to say Jai Saimaster every second.  Isn't it?? Cheesy
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« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2009, 03:31:31 PM »

Jai Sai Master, Babu garu..
Jai Sai Master, Sai Bandhus..

Jai Sai Master, Dear Srushti..

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How do the Kalahari Bushmen live without owning anything??




Quote
I can't imagine not having own clothes,house,parents,food,etc. How do they not own anything?? 


Quote
You mean to say as a spiritual person you are not supposed to own anything??
Srushti, for this particular question, that is not what Veda garu said. It is more like as a spiritual person, you don't truly need them or atleast as a developing spiritual person, you will let go of them slowly, one by one. Let's say as an example, materialistically speaking, you have a toy that you like very much. In one year or whatever time it is, you will get bored with it, then you won't find your toy worth playing it with. You will abandon it. Or you will give it to someone else. Or plainly you will throw it away. So, why did you get bored with it? Why did you want to just throw it away? Because your mind/heart does not find it amusing anymore. You will look for a new toy worth exciting.

So, in this example, I have explained only non-spiritual aspect of it. I have not experienced the spirituality of not owning anything but according to ancient Indian sages, according to Sai Baba, we will all reach a stage where we will lost interest in every single thing in this world.

So, in continuation of the above example of your favourite toy not being your favourite anymore, I will give you another side of the same example. Let's say you have given your toy to your little brother or sister, then your sister/brother will think "how can she give away such a lovely toy? I can't imagine not having that toy OR....I can't imagine not losing that toy"

BUT for you...you had your share of experience with it and you move on you are just happy without it.

So, in the case of a small example like Toy, it may take 1 month or 1 year or maximum of 5 years to lose interest. But in case of not having clothes, house, parents, food, it will take thousands and thousands of lives and still be happy without them. It is possible only for great Saints.

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If they do own anything are they really not spiritual?? Since you said owning nothing is the characteristic feature of spiritual way of living.

Even if they own something, they are still spiritual as long as they can let of go of them without any sadness or bad feeling in their hearts/minds. So, what Veda garu meant in saying "owning nothing is the characteristic of spiritual living" is also equal to having it and not caring for it. If you don't care whether you have those things or not, then even if they are with you, you are same and even if they are lost, you are still the same. That is called "owning nothing" being Spiritual. Hope I am not confusing you.


Quote
When you said Baba is there in the situation watching our thoughts and actions, why did Baba create some situations like the bomb blasts in Mumbai, or the tsunami in Burma that killed innocent people?? For E.X. a patient who has a serious problem is admitted in a hospital. Baba created that situation because the patient got what was nessacery. As a doctor his duty is to rescue that patient, in this situation is the doctor going against Baba's will?? If Baba is in this situation why does the patient's family pray to Baba that he gets better?? Not just them, why do we pray even though Baba is in that situation too?? (I came to the same question why should we pray for better things?)

Sai Bandhus, these are some complex questions. Any takers?

Srushti, althought Baba is always there everywhere and in every person, it is also important for every person to recognize that Baba is in that person. Baba never created a situation like Bomb Blasts in Mumbai or the Tsunami in Burma. Baba also never created that situation where a patient has a serious problem admitted into the hospital. But inspite of not creating those situations, he is still there, watching those situations, watching people, and trying to help people who could recognize Baba. For example, in the Mumbai blasts, terrorists killed innocent people, so those killers do not recognize or believe in Baba or for that matter any God. They do not even believe in religion, prayers....they do not believe in Saints...they do not believe in love and respect for fellow citizens. Inspite of that, Baba is still there wathing them and being IN them. But do they recognize HIM? No...I hope I answered to your Satisfaction.

Also, definitely, I agree, it is Doctor's duty to rescue the patient, so why did you get the doubt that he going against Baba's will? Like I said just above, Baba is ever watching us in all the situations, and in this case, when the patient is seriously ill, Baba will rescue in the form of that doctor. Baba does not need to come physically as Sai Baba of Shirdi to come there. Because Baba is everywhere and in every person, He will try to rescue the patient in the form of the doctor. But being a patient, sometimes, we reap the bad things also according to what we may have done in this live of previous life. This aspect is called Karma and unfortunately, it is too big of a topic to be discussed by just you and me. And it also takes lot of time to understand even the simple definition of Karma. But just as a quick example, I will try to make you understand the importance of Karma and reaping good/bad benefits as per our actions.

For example, let's suppose, as a 25 year old man,I start eating lots of fatty food, oily food, sugary drinks etc etc. I do that on day one, I don't notice it. I do it on day two, I don't notice it. I keep on doing it for weeks, months, years. My body slowly starts decomposing. So, by the time I am 35, I am over-weight and I have lots of bodily problems. In the same way, mentally, I think of doing bad to others, 10% on day one 15% on day two etc etc, and in ten years time, I start doing bad things to other people my mind is completely filled with bad thoughts.

In both the situations above, I did it myself. Who gave me the thoughts? Suddenly, at the age of 35, I read Master's book or Sai Baba's book and I start to think maybe I am doing wrong, maybe my actions are incorrect. So, now, when I ask Baba like this .."Baba please remove my bodily discomfort, please forgive my actions for what I did to other people..." Then Baba or for that matter any God or any Saint does not agree to that. That is the law of the universe. Every single action that we do reaps something.

Then you might ask me, then why Pray Baba when everything is dependent on our actions. This is what is exactly discussed in Master gari book, "Sai Master Pravachanamulu" which your mom can teach you about, but let me cover that subject also. True our actions decide what we reap. But at the same time, if you closley look at it, we also need Baba to slowly erase what has been done, not by overnight cancellation of our actions but by slowly understanding our mistakes, and by slowly taking in our stride whatever hardship that we got. So, we need Baba to help us walk during the times of our hardship which are brought about by our own action. So, when I ate badly for 10 years, instead of asking Baba to remove my bad eating action, Baba will give me the strength to go through that hardship for some years and at the same time, HE will also give me the intelligence to not eat bad food anymore. So, this is like your mom is earning $3000 and she not only repays 1500$ for the loans taken but also 1500$ into your savings account for future happiness. So, when I follow Baba-given intelligence, what happens is, I go through the stomach pain for the bad eating, bravely and at the same time, I won't eat fatty and oily foods, and also I will drink lots of water. So, in a couple of years time, I am healthy again.

In this very detailed example, as you can see, we are reaping the result of our actions and at the same time, Baba is helping us go through those results in a nice way.

In the same way, a patient maybe seriously ill, but that is not created by Baba. He will watch that situation, but He will help accordingly as per the patient's belief and faith and his past actions.

Also, the patient's family will pray to Baba to make the patient healthy again, and there is nothing wrong in it Srushti. Although, it is not the ideal way of praying, it is nevertheless not a bad one. Almost 99.99% of us, will never be able to say "Baba, do whatever is right according to my actions done previously or in my previous life". So, we should infact ask Baba to decrease the patient's ill-health or atleast give the strength to go through with it. This will not only benfit the patient but also strengthens our faith in Baba. Don't you think so?

Quote
but sometimes we forget that Baba is in everybody. How do we always remember?? In that case do we have to say Jai Saimaster every second.  Isn't it??

Srushti, we definitely forget that Baba is in everybody. All of us forget, not just sometimes, but all the time. Also you should observe, although saying Jai Sai Master every second is not possible (is it possible? you should answer that..) what we mean to say is, in normal conditions, we will definitely forget that Baba is in everybody. But the term "Jai Sai Master", if practised properly, will remind us of Baba and Master every time we say it in front of a person. So, it is like saying "Glory to the SaiMaster in you" to whoever you are saying "Jai Sai Master". Also, by saying Jai Sai Master, you will learn to see the person in a truly universal way. Let's say, your class mate ill-treated you, but you meet in a common gathering in a Sai Temple, when you say "Jai Sai Master", then you will truly forget that that person has ill-treated you and you will also truly forgive that person. So, Jai Sai Master is not only like a tonic for that person for his/her ill-behaviour but Jai Sai Master is also like a useful tool for you to recognize many important aspects of life.

Srushti, I will post further on this thread, once I collect my thoughts from Sai Master's books. Also, the reason I left the start of my answers blank, is because I have an idea on your questions but I don't know how to answer them. So, I will revisit those questions once I start collecting my thoughts so that I can clarify your doubts effectively.

Take care till then..

Jai Sai Master!
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Jai Swamy Sai!
swayam
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« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2009, 07:12:13 PM »

Jai Sai Master!

Dear Srusti and Sai Bandhus

Sorry to use your space here Srusti, but even I have same questions as you have asked.

Just want to get some clarity in my understanding.Sorry if this confuses you more.

We all would have read below in Sai Satcharita or Sai Leelamrutamu

1) "Iam the wire puller"

2) "Without my permission even a leaf can not  move"

3) "Iam the doer"  -->This one is not from Sai Leelamruthamu, but I took it from one of the postings of WhoAmI.

Now in light of our present discussion, how should we understand above statements.

I think, what above statements (1) and (2) means here is, it is not that Baba who does everything in the world.But Baba has capability to change what can happen or lessen/nullify the impact of what has already happened depending upon whether  individual(s) involved deserves or not.Which inturn depends on whether he/she has done enough sadhana or seva which can nullify his karma.

Am I correct in my understanding ?

There is one Baba’s leela, where he saves one person from train accident by asking that person to get down from 3rd compartment and move to last compartments of the train.Ultimately the train meets with an accident and all the people in the first 3 compartments die. When I first read this, the question I got is why did not Baba save all the people in the train, why only this person. On further thinking, the answer is Karma.That person has deserved to be saved and so he got saved.

Am I correct in my understanding ?

Coming to statement (3).How should I understand this statement.
If HE is the doer, why Am I facing the consequences(ofcourse irrepsective of whether the
consequences are happy/sad or godd/bad).The question might sound bit mischievous,but I still need an answer.
Iam also thinking.

Jai Sai Master!



« Last Edit: February 24, 2009, 07:19:53 PM by swayam » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2009, 09:02:07 PM »

Jai Sai Master, Babu garu..
Jai Sai Master, Sai Bandhus..

Swayam garu, Jai Sai Master..

Quote
If HE is the doer, why Am I facing the consequences(ofcourse irrepsective of whether the
consequences are happy/sad or godd/bad).The question might sound bit mischievous,but I still need an answer.
Iam also thinking.

HE is the "doer" not based on Karma. He is the "Doer" to undo the bad karma that we got into and to improve the good karma that we did.

As an example, our Sadguru Sai Baba is both nirguna niraakaarudu and Saguna saakaarudu (I hope I typed it correctly but I do understand the meanings). As Nirguna Niraakaarudu, He keeps watching this universe, BEING THE UNIVERSE. And as Sakaarudu, He will take a physical form (one of the many things that He will do) to remove our bad karma and push us towards good karma.

So, as with the second example, HE is the "Doer" of destruction of our karma.

I know I gave a very vague example, but I hope you got the point.

Regards,
Jai Sai Master
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Jai Sai Master!
Jai Swamy Sai!
asterias
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« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2009, 01:13:06 AM »

Jai Sai Master !

Dear Swayam garu,

Have you read all the books read by Mastergaru esp Sai Prabodhamrutamu and Pravachanalu ? The doubts that you are asking are all mentioned there.

Basically you are asking things which differ for people of different level. If Baba says "Sit quiet I ll do the needful. Not even a leaf moves without my grace", think if we are really sitting quiet! We are not. Again if you talk of Karma, you cant talk of Sadguru Krupa (Please read the chapter, Purva Karma, Sadguru Krupa - from Sai Master Pravachanalu).

I would suggest that you go through books to understand things in much better way, since its Mastergaru Himself who wrote those books.

Jai Sai Master !
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« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2009, 02:59:42 AM »

Jai Sai Master!

Dear Asterias garu

Great! thanks for the references.My association with HIM started only since past 7 months.
I do have these books, I need to read them one by one. I didn't know that these questions
are discussed there.Thanks again.

Jai Sai Master!
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« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2009, 04:07:58 AM »

Jai Sai Master !

You would not probably believe me, but almost everything that you ever wanted to know regarding spirituality, right from how to lead our daily lives, the importance of certain things that we are asked to do, how to do dhyanam, proof of God, how the society should be, how to approach saints and Mahatmas, how to avoid pitfalls, how to raise from pit falls, etc etc .. everything is there in Mastergaru's books. There is not only what, but also how and why. If I may say so, the only way for us to even think about spirituality correctly, is through Mastergaru's books.

Also I would recommend you to listen to Mastergaru's speeches available for free on saimaster.com !!

Jai Sai Master !
« Last Edit: February 25, 2009, 04:10:18 AM by asterias » Logged
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« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2009, 06:54:26 AM »

Jai Sai Master.
Dear Srushti,
1) About Bushmen: Since childhood, we see everybody owning something and trying to own something better.We give value to somebody based upon how much he owns.That is how our society works.

Bushmen, since childhood, see everybody around them reacting to needs..such as hunger, thirst, shelter and security.If they feel hungry they hunt for food and eat for the day. If there is cold weather, they sit before fire. They see Mother Nature as a source for fulfilling their needs. Infact they don't know the concept of owning land, food, money etc.Because they are social beings by nature, they live together.

Even I don't know much about them...I  was just trying to put accross what Dwaraka Uncle meant while he was referring their name.

2) If your stomach is completely full, u dont feel like eating anything more... even if your delicious dishes are kept before u, isn't it? That would be the state of 100% spiritual life. It would be like an Extremely richman choosing to be simple.It is not about owning/ not owning things... it is about not having the desire to own them. A spiritually elevated person like baba is not bothered whether he has/doesn't have something. He is not disturbed even if everything he has is lost. There is no change in his peace of mind and happiness. On seeing him we know that he is not emotionally attached to anything. So there is no need for him to own something. That is what I meant when I said 'not owning something is  the characteristic feature of spiritual way of life'.

I will try to answer other questions in my next reply.
Jai Sai master.
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